Apocalypse Chime

Rule System Stress

New 04 Oct 2023 Asked by j-waffles 42 Comments

One of the playtest cards from Gavin’s unknown event was a card that referenced the MOM legendary team up cards; and he said that the card didn’t really work within the rules. Although that is technically true, I find it hard to believe it could not be easily worked into the rules. Obviously it is clearly understood from the average player POV, but from a rules perspective, why couldn’t there just be a section in the rules that lists all the cards that are legal options? That already exists for Apocalypse Chime, City in a Bottle, and Golgothian Sylex; and I would argue they are far less intuitive or easy to remember when it comes to what cards they apply to. This isn’t me demanding that Gavin’s card be made legal, more so it’s me asking: why can’t cards like that get made? Cards/mechanics that reference a small and intuitive list of cards, with the comprehensive rules having a formal definition for that list?


It comes down to how much stress does it put on the system and is it worth that stress? We believe the answer is no, because it’s a lot of stress for minimal pay off. That’s why acorn/silver-border cards exist. There are things that are practically easy to use, but are onerous on the rules system. Those cards should exist because they’re fun, but we can do so without causing problems with the larger rules structure.

Implementing Rare-B-Gone

New 27 Sep 2022 Asked by admiralsmash-blog 33 Comments

Re: Rare-B-Gone, couldn't it work in black border the same way Apocalypse Chime and all the other expansion matters cards do, by caring about the original rarity a card was printed at? That way reprints don't impact its effect.


That requires too much knowledge. For example, without access to a database, do you know the rarity of first printing of cards? Does counter target common spell stop a Disenchant? Or a Counterspell? Or a Lightning Bolt?

Intuitive Batching and CR Consultation

New 05 Jul 2022 Asked by bobbymcbobbo 31 Comments

I would say that Apocalypse Chime, City in a Bottle and Golgothian Sylex were the first cards that used the concept of "batching". However, their batch is explicitly defined in the comprehensive rules (CR), and would be a little long to fit in reminder text. Would you ever make another "intuitive" batch where it can be roughly described in reminder text, but you might have to consult the CR in order to know 100% whether something is part of the batch?


Yes, if the batch was generally intuitive enough that players could guess at 99% of it.

Complex Rules and Card Bans

New 11 Jan 2022 Asked by moonsliceman 26 Comments

There's a pretty healthy number of cards that cause general rules complexity for their own sake. Graveyard order matters, Apocalypse Chime, Circling Vultures, Word of Command, Illusionary Mask, etc. Are there any ideas in R&D or WotC to ban or errata these kinds of effects to make the rules and processes of the game that much smoother?


Many of the things you’re talking about, we’ve removed from the game, so in the vast majority of formats, they are no longer a thing. One of the downsides to eternal formats is that things seldom leave.

Border Changes for Effects

New 08 Jul 2021 Asked by tybonel13 33 Comments

Hey Mark! Are City in a Bottle/Golgothian Sylex/Apocalypse Chime effects still black border, or have they moved to silver border like World-Bottling Kit? If they are black border will we ever see this effect again?


Black border can no longer mechanically reference expansion symbols.

Legacy Legal Cards

New 16 Feb 2019 Asked by tbjanowski 39 Comments

City in a bottle, golgothian sylix and Apocalypse Chime are still legal in legacy and vintage, so cards can care about what expansion they are from are just not silver boarder?


The way the cards work in Oracle is they list every single card it affects. It doesn’t look at the expansion symbol. For example, if you have Triskelion from a core set without an Antiquities expansion symbol, it will still die to the Sylix.

Card Text Limitations

New 30 Sep 2018 Asked by centurosplaneswalker 35 Comments

FWIW, Golgothan Sylex, Apocalypse Chime, etc can actually fit on the cards, it's just that it would require the internet to be at hand when played (Gatherer says, for example, "Destroy all nontoken permanents with a name originally printed in the Homelands expansion. They can't be regenerated.")


But it doesn’t really fit on the card when you have to look up the longer answer to know what the card does.

Watermarks and Rules

New 29 Sep 2018 Asked by completeindie 35 Comments

FYI, the rules can SOMEWHAT care about watermarks, I'd imagine. Looking at the comp. rules, the cards City in a Bottle, Golgothaian Slyex, and Apocalypse Chime all care about expansions they were ORIGINALLY printed in. Could the rules care about cards that were printed with an Izzet watermark, at ANY time in the card's history?


Those cards’ Oracle text can’t fit on the cards. They’re the reason things like expansion symbols and watermarks can’t be referenced in black border.

Game Mechanic Shifts

New 03 Jun 2017 Asked by mandenmeddengulehat 11 Comments

Powerlevel and playability sat aside are cards like Apocalypse Chime still doable in blackborder? Also do you make many judgecalls during Tuesday draft/sealed?


We’ve moved away from those type of effects as the expansion symbol is no longer something black border cards can care about.I’ve yet to be asked to make a judge call. There are a lot more qualified people in the Pit to ask rules questions.

Expansion Specific Mechanics

New 28 Jan 2015 Asked by grayer 46 Comments

Since Fate Reforged forever altered the world shown in Khans of Tarkir, wouldn't now be a good time to have a card like "City in a Bottle" or "Apocalypse Chime" to completely wipe out Khans of Tarkir?


As black border can’t care about expansion symbols, it makes such a card almost impossible to make. The errataed version of City in a Bottle won’t fit in the text box of a normal card.

Set Hosers Concept

New 26 Apr 2014 Asked by zwomally 15 Comments

What was the reasoning behind old-school set hosers like Apocalypse Chime?


We like to have safety valves in case something breaks. I think the idea was a set safety valve. Not one of our better ideas.

Future of Expansion Symbols

New 24 Jan 2014 Asked by gay-fucking-goblin 7 Comments

Will we ever get more cards like Apocalypse Chime? I'm assuming not, but it'd be really funny


We have stopped doing cards the reference expansion symbols in black bordered Magic.

Set-Specific Hoses

New 16 Nov 2012 Asked by vickysaurus 5 Comments

Has a card that hoses a particular set, like Apocalypse Chime or City in a Bottle, ever been considered by R&D since Homelands? (Other than City-Bottling Kit)


Yes, for Un-sets. (Unhinged had World-Bottling Kit.) No for black-bordered sets. Expansion symbols are no longer something cards can track.

Homelands Favorite

New 13 Oct 2012 Asked by alsadius-blog-blog 5 Comments

What is your favourite card from Homelands that's named "Apocalypse Chime"?


: )


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